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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 14:35:22 GMT
Indeed, as did many Daily Mail comments. To be honest though it's quite easy to offer something you know you won't have to deliver. That's where the LibDems went wrong in 2010 and ending up in the coalition. Yes the LIbdems have learned a lesson. All they offer now are gimmicks
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 14:41:27 GMT
Yes it does feel like the Tories have completely imploded. All those idiots on the other forum can do is keep repeating Labour will be worse. It is all they have left. Starmer's biggest selling point is the Tories for it is difficult to imagine how anything or anyone can possibly be worse than them. That there remain millions of people who even now think the Tories are the best option for this country is itself a tribute to the stupidity of electorates. Well I don't know from what you've said he has stolen your party.
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Post by andrewbrown on May 27, 2024 14:47:40 GMT
Indeed, as did many Daily Mail comments. To be honest though it's quite easy to offer something you know you won't have to deliver. That's where the LibDems went wrong in 2010 and ending up in the coalition. Yes the LIbdems have learned a lesson. All they offer now are gimmicks But that's what they can't do. They have to hope that Labour fall short and need LibDems support. If all they have is gimmicks then they will suffer the same as they did post coalition.
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 14:55:27 GMT
Yes the LIbdems have learned a lesson. All they offer now are gimmicks But that's what they can't do. They have to hope that Labour fall short and need LibDems support. If all they have is gimmicks then they will suffer the same as they did post coalition. Agreed, but I've tried to fathom their manifesto and there's nothing in there. And Ed Davies is this.
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Steve
Hero Protagonist
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Post by Steve on May 27, 2024 17:16:51 GMT
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 17:43:01 GMT
Apologies I used 'Manifesto@ as a short cut for the words on their site. This stuff. 1. Fair, prosperous and innovative economy that promotes opportunity and wellbeing. 2. Fair access to good public services and a strong social safety net. 3. A flourishing environment, with fair access to nature for all. 4. A strong United Kingdom and a fair international order. 5. A truly fair democracy, where everyone’s rights are respected and individuals and communities are empowered. Apparently they are going to be fair.
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 27, 2024 18:07:09 GMT
I liked these words:
● Make taxes fair, ensuring that tax burdens don’t fall disproportionately on low earners, reversing the Conservatives’ tax cuts for big banks, and abolishing the separate Capital Gains tax-free allowance, to tax income from wealth more similarly to income from work.'
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 18:48:15 GMT
I liked these words: ● Make taxes fair, ensuring that tax burdens don’t fall disproportionately on low earners, reversing the Conservatives’ tax cuts for big banks, and abolishing the separate Capital Gains tax-free allowance, to tax income from wealth more similarly to income from work.'Me too. I particularly dislike the idea that in times of trouble we take money from the young and poor and give it to the old and rich, but never the other way round. Its a scam.
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 18:49:04 GMT
I liked these words: ● Make taxes fair, ensuring that tax burdens don’t fall disproportionately on low earners, reversing the Conservatives’ tax cuts for big banks, and abolishing the separate Capital Gains tax-free allowance, to tax income from wealth more similarly to income from work.'Is that from the LIbdems?
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Post by montegriffo on May 27, 2024 18:58:12 GMT
I liked these words: ● Make taxes fair, ensuring that tax burdens don’t fall disproportionately on low earners, reversing the Conservatives’ tax cuts for big banks, and abolishing the separate Capital Gains tax-free allowance, to tax income from wealth more similarly to income from work.'Is that from the LIbdems? It's a fair chance...
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 27, 2024 19:03:43 GMT
I liked these words: ● Make taxes fair, ensuring that tax burdens don’t fall disproportionately on low earners, reversing the Conservatives’ tax cuts for big banks, and abolishing the separate Capital Gains tax-free allowance, to tax income from wealth more similarly to income from work.'Is that from the LIbdems? yep from their pre-manifesto. Probably easier to find in the pdf version
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2024 19:35:32 GMT
It is all they have left. Starmer's biggest selling point is the Tories for it is difficult to imagine how anything or anyone can possibly be worse than them. That there remain millions of people who even now think the Tories are the best option for this country is itself a tribute to the stupidity of electorates. Well I don't know from what you've said he has stolen your party. Unlike you, I was actually inside the party and saw what was happening from the inside. He did not actually seize control of the party. He persuaded enough members with his lies to be given the party in a free and democratic vote, albeit one based on dishonest promises which fooled the gullible. But whether or not he stole the party is besides the point. It is truly difficult to imagine them being anything but an improvement - however modest - on what we have now.
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Post by Zany on May 27, 2024 20:28:32 GMT
Well I don't know from what you've said he has stolen your party. Unlike you, I was actually inside the party and saw what was happening from the inside. He did not actually seize control of the party. He persuaded enough members with his lies to be given the party in a free and democratic vote, albeit one based on dishonest promises which fooled the gullible. But whether or not he stole the party is besides the point. It is truly difficult to imagine them being anything but an improvement - however modest - on what we have now. Don't mistake me SRB, I was being sympathetic to you and those who thought the party had returned to its deep socialist principles and they were being stolen away from you. I can understand why it happened. Corbyn lead the party into the 2019 election and got rinsed. So the party faithful say ok we can't get elected with this remit. Along comes a guy with a more central remit and the party moves. I understand who really believe in your socialism, but fact is the country doesn't. For me Sir Kier is brilliant, not because he brings everything I would like, but because like Blair he brings a more central yet acceptable politics than the Tories offer.
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 27, 2024 20:43:27 GMT
Unlike you, I was actually inside the party and saw what was happening from the inside. He did not actually seize control of the party. He persuaded enough members with his lies to be given the party in a free and democratic vote, albeit one based on dishonest promises which fooled the gullible. But whether or not he stole the party is besides the point. It is truly difficult to imagine them being anything but an improvement - however modest - on what we have now. Don't mistake me SRB, I was being sympathetic to you and those who thought the party had returned to its deep socialist principles and they were being stolen away from you. I can understand why it happened. Corbyn lead the party into the 2019 election and got rinsed. So the party faithful say ok we can't get elected with this remit. Along comes a guy with a more central remit and the party moves. I understand who really believe in your socialism, but fact is the country doesn't. For me Sir Kier is brilliant, not because he brings everything I would like, but because like Blair he brings a more central yet acceptable politics than the Tories offer. The ones that stole that party were Momentum and their poster boys Jeremy my friends Hamas Corbyn and John knee capper Donnell. Kinnoch, Smith and Blair made that party a true representation of the best interests of workers which is what it should be not some drive for Cuba without the Sun.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2024 21:39:43 GMT
Unlike you, I was actually inside the party and saw what was happening from the inside. He did not actually seize control of the party. He persuaded enough members with his lies to be given the party in a free and democratic vote, albeit one based on dishonest promises which fooled the gullible. But whether or not he stole the party is besides the point. It is truly difficult to imagine them being anything but an improvement - however modest - on what we have now. Don't mistake me SRB, I was being sympathetic to you and those who thought the party had returned to its deep socialist principles and they were being stolen away from you. I can understand why it happened. Corbyn lead the party into the 2019 election and got rinsed. So the party faithful say ok we can't get elected with this remit. Along comes a guy with a more central remit and the party moves. I understand who really believe in your socialism, but fact is the country doesn't. For me Sir Kier is brilliant, not because he brings everything I would like, but because like Blair he brings a more central yet acceptable politics than the Tories offer. Actually, polling at the time showed that the country very much did believe in most of the 2017 policies. I have posted links to that polling evidence for you multiple times, though you appear as here to repeatedly display your ignorance of it and likely failure to even look at it. Believing something whilst refusing to look at the evidence that says otherwise is not the basis of an informed argument, merely a desire to believe what you want to believe. It was Corbyn himself and Labour's policy on Brexit that the country didnt like. Not what was on offer policy wise in 2017
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