Steve
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Post by Steve on May 21, 2024 11:10:54 GMT
. . .The Commonwealth offers the best way to meet our strategic food needs.  oh Vinny you do tell them. |
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 21, 2024 11:14:12 GMT
The CAP is a monumentally inefficient waste of cash, it doesn't work. And the food mountains it produces often get dumped into the developed world, impacting farming there. We are overpopulated, there isn't enough farmland in our country to feed everyone, even with total subsidy of farming. We need imports, and we now have a better way of importing. . . . We haven't been able to comfortably feed ourselves for well over 100 years but we had priority access to a vast supply of food at low cost. And you threw it away. |
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Post by vinny on May 21, 2024 11:27:07 GMT
No, the priority access to low cost food was thrown away when we joined the EEC and threw away free trade with the Commonwealth.
A market of 56 countries with a population of 2,418,964,000.
We still have free trade with the EU.
Food trade with the EU is still tariff free.
We should be thinking about development of the Commonwealth.
Strengthening democracy within it, striving for economic and social parity (based on the highest standards) and bringing down trade barriers across the Commonwealth as members develop until all citizens of the Commonwealth have equal rights and living standards.
To achieve that we need carrot and stick policies.
We need to suspend nations whose governments are deliberately failing, whilst rewarding nations that are succeeding, with free trade.
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 21, 2024 11:43:56 GMT
Anyone believing the Commonwealth offered us priority access to food probably believes in fairies. We got the commonwealth special dispensations to trade with us and they still said get stuffed when we had various world food crises. Always worth remembering the Commonwealth consists mainly of countries we spent centuries screwing. they owe us nothing and have better markets to sell to now.
You say 'Food trade with the EU is still tariff free.' but why can you not work out that means we now have to compete with lower wages yet can't use same on our farms.
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Post by vinny on May 21, 2024 12:54:55 GMT
We competed with lower wages when we were in the EU and the result was soaring unemployment here including the closure of food factories such as the Cadbury's Keynesham factory.
Farms are still subsidised.
There is agricultural tax relief.
Farming is not a good enough reason to have EU membership.
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 22, 2024 9:07:00 GMT
Has Brexit brought those Cadbury factories back? No because the wages are still lower in Poland
Farming is just one of many reasons why we were better off in. They all add up
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Post by vinny on May 22, 2024 11:10:01 GMT
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 22, 2024 19:56:12 GMT
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Post by AvonCalling on May 23, 2024 9:45:01 GMT
Weren't we pretty much at the bottom throughout the period of the graph
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Post by vinny on May 23, 2024 10:36:18 GMT
We've been at the bottom for decades.
We went into decline in the 1970's after joining the EEC and our industrial heartlands never recovered.
All the other countries in that graph have much more diverse economies than we do.
We are too obsessed with services.
We need to train more plumbers, electricians, joiners, bricklayers, steel workers, factory workers, and mine workers.
Why would we need to mine coal again? Steel. That's why.
It makes no sense to import coal for steel production, given there's so much underneath us.
We need to make steel, for buildings, for cars, for power generators, for aero engines, and for the military.
It isn't sensible to put strategically important tech into the hands of rival nations, especially enemy regimes like the scum in charge of China.
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Steve
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Post by Steve on May 23, 2024 12:05:59 GMT
You're both missing the point that the chart is normalised to 2016. No major economy has seen investment in jobs fall as much as the UK has since that Brexit vote.
Because it was stupid and only obtained by lies and skullduggery. Time the guilty are held to account.
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Post by AvonCalling on May 23, 2024 15:16:04 GMT
You're both missing the point that the chart is normalised to 2016. No major economy has seen investment in jobs fall as much as the UK has since that Brexit vote. Because it was stupid and only obtained by lies and skullduggery. Time the guilty are held to account. But you have the pro lem that always exists which is establishing a CLEAR causality between Brexit and this. There will be other factors that affect investment decisions not just Brexit. I think Brexit was shooting ourselves in the foot but you can't just dump a graph that shows something and say this is because of Brexit |
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Post by AvonCalling on May 23, 2024 15:18:26 GMT
We've been at the bottom for decades. We went into decline in the 1970's after joining the EEC and our industrial heartlands never recovered. All the other countries in that graph have much more diverse economies than we do. We are too obsessed with services. We need to train more plumbers, electricians, joiners, bricklayers, steel workers, factory workers, and mine workers. Why would we need to mine coal again? Steel. That's why. It makes no sense to import coal for steel production, given there's so much underneath us. We need to make steel, for buildings, for cars, for power generators, for aero engines, and for the military. It isn't sensible to put strategically important tech into the hands of rival nations, especially enemy regimes like the scum in charge of China. Well to take one point there is a case for importing coal if it's cheaper than digging it out yourself. Of course using coal at all probably clashes with our environmental obligations. There may be a case to dig out coal rather than importing it if we accept that it is costing more and we take this hit for strategic read security reasons |
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Post by vinny on May 23, 2024 16:24:23 GMT
Lower carbon footprint from digging it out ourselves.
And in the absence of an alternative (abundant hydrogen) it's the best option for the production of virgin steel.
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Steve
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Posts: 3,633
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Post by Steve on May 23, 2024 17:03:12 GMT
You're both missing the point that the chart is normalised to 2016. No major economy has seen investment in jobs fall as much as the UK has since that Brexit vote. Because it was stupid and only obtained by lies and skullduggery. Time the guilty are held to account. But you have the pro lem that always exists which is establishing a CLEAR causality between Brexit and this. There will be other factors that affect investment decisions not just Brexit. I think Brexit was shooting ourselves in the foot but you can't just dump a graph that shows something and say this is because of Brexit But it is the no shit Sherlock explanation for the massive correlation. Why would anyone invest as much as they used to do in a country that tore up its friction free access to the worlds biggest market? |
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