|
|
Post by Saint on Apr 4, 2024 19:41:40 GMT
Exactly! If you see something in the GeneralZone that you would like discussed in the more sedate environment of the MindZone, you could just start a thread on the topic in the Mindzone. If people refuse to engage your argument in the Mindzone, that will tell you that they have no argument. But there's no need to have just one zone. So you are setting up two ares to discuss the same thing...one full of personal insults and one expressed in a mutually respective manner. Yes. I want an area where people have to be respectful to you. I also want an area where I don't have to be respectful to the likes of Klan Dan. |
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 4, 2024 19:47:20 GMT
I dont know what planet you come from, but no. In my world you start with what you want, set the boundaries, allow varience under Rules like in real life and stand firm. There is no reason why any opinion cannot be expressed in good manners and with considered explanation. You could believe anything as long as you explain THE IDEA and not attack those who believe it. Just decide on what you want this group to be and defend it. It is really simple. On my planet, people are realistic. A two-tier system wouldn't affect you in the slightest. The GeneralZone would be a place you would never have to go. You would have all the benefits of a forum regulated to the standard you want. Where's the problem? What is the problem with the usual format of respecful discussion being the norm and potty mouths being the exception? |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on Apr 4, 2024 19:52:43 GMT
On my planet, people are realistic. A two-tier system wouldn't affect you in the slightest. The GeneralZone would be a place you would never have to go. You would have all the benefits of a forum regulated to the standard you want. Where's the problem? What is the problem with the usual format of respecful discussion being the norm and potty mouths being the exception? Good question. If you can show me a forum from the entire internet where respectful political discussion is the norm, you will go a long way towards convincing me you are right. Can you do that? Please leave a link, if so. Otherwise, please accept that you are asking for the impossible. There just isn't a market for what you are proposing. That's not a good thing - but it's the real world. With a two-tier system, there is at least the possibility you will get some of what you want. Without it, there's nothing. I mean, who from the right-wing do you think will want to discuss politics with you on any forum Orac establishes that has the same or higher standards than Tinculin's site? Please name names from all the right-wing members on Tinculin's site. Can you name even one? |
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 4, 2024 20:00:44 GMT
Look. This is not my problem. It is up to the mods to decide what they want in their forum.
I can then decide if it is worth my time.
My time doesnt change what they decide. Just what I decide to do with the time I volunteer.
It is like whether I think it is worth shouting into the wind or not.
This forum2 was set up to clean up the forum1. Why do you want to allow it to happen again?
Comeon Mods. State a vision and define it in proscriptive barriers.
|
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 4, 2024 20:05:45 GMT
What is the problem with the usual format of respecful discussion being the norm and potty mouths being the exception? Good question. If you can show me a forum from the entire internet where respectful political discussion is the norm, you will go a long way towards convincing me you are right. Can you do that? Please leave a link, if so. Otherwise, please accept that you are asking for the impossible. There just isn't a market for what you are proposing. That's not a good thing - but it's the real world. With a two-tier system, there is at least the possibility you will get some of what you want. Without it, there's nothing. I mean, who from the right-wing do you think will want to discuss politics with you on any forum Orac establishes that has the same or higher standards than Tinculin's site? Please name names from all the right-wing members on Tinculin's site. Can you name even one? I am not going to be drawn into any name calling. That is what happens when i leave spaces. Do you not realise you are now turning this discussion into a personal adversarial combat? |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on Apr 4, 2024 20:06:32 GMT
Look. This is not my problem. It is up to the mods to decide what they want in their forum. I can then decide if it is worth my time. My time doesnt change what they decide. Just what I decide to do with the time I volunteer. It is like whether I think it is worth shouting into the wind or not. This forum2 was set up to clean up the forum1. Why do you want to allow it to happen again? Comeon Mods. State a vision and define it in proscriptive barriers. My proposal will clean up the forum. It's objective is to make the Mindzone more attractive. I have proposed ways of doing this above. Could you please use the quote function? It allows me to know when someone has responded to one of my posts. It's a simple courtesy that imposes no demands on you. |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on Apr 4, 2024 20:08:14 GMT
Good question. If you can show me a forum from the entire internet where respectful political discussion is the norm, you will go a long way towards convincing me you are right. Can you do that? Please leave a link, if so. Otherwise, please accept that you are asking for the impossible. There just isn't a market for what you are proposing. That's not a good thing - but it's the real world. With a two-tier system, there is at least the possibility you will get some of what you want. Without it, there's nothing. I mean, who from the right-wing do you think will want to discuss politics with you on any forum Orac establishes that has the same or higher standards than Tinculin's site? Please name names from all the right-wing members on Tinculin's site. Can you name even one? I am not going to be drawn into any name calling. That is what happens when i leave spaces. Do you not realise you are now turning this discussion into a personal adversarial combat? I was being serious when I asked you to provide a link to a forum where polite political discussion is the norm. At least, show us that your vision is realistic. I want a space for serious political discussion, too. I'm just more pragmatic about what is attainable. |
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 4, 2024 20:31:05 GMT
Example....the discussionds we have had in here.
No special place for the respectful. It wasnt necessary.
I have trouble assigning a special place for the adults. In my experience there used to be a special place for the infants.
There should be NO SPECIAL PLACE for the adults. That should be the norm.
If you design a forum for adults why make a special place for adults?
Just keep the children away.
|
|
|
|
Post by montegriffo on Apr 4, 2024 20:32:11 GMT
Look. This is not my problem. It is up to the mods to decide what they want in their forum. I can then decide if it is worth my time. My time doesnt change what they decide. Just what I decide to do with the time I volunteer. It is like whether I think it is worth shouting into the wind or not. This forum2 was set up to clean up the forum1. Why do you want to allow it to happen again? Comeon Mods. State a vision and define it in proscriptive barriers. There are no mods. |
|
|
|
Post by Orac on Apr 4, 2024 20:36:48 GMT
Example....the discussionds we have had in here. No special place for the respectful. It wasnt necessary. I have trouble assigning a special place for the adults. In my experience there used to be a special place for the infants. There should be NO SPECIAL PLACE for the adults. That should be the norm. If you design a forum for adults why make a special place for adults? Just keep the children away. You have just insulted those who disagree with you (called them children). However, I think there is a valid role for insults in this discussion. This often happens btw |
|
|
|
Post by montegriffo on Apr 4, 2024 20:47:29 GMT
Example....the discussionds we have had in here. No special place for the respectful. It wasnt necessary. I have trouble assigning a special place for the adults. In my experience there used to be a special place for the infants. There should be NO SPECIAL PLACE for the adults. That should be the norm. If you design a forum for adults why make a special place for adults? Just keep the children away. You have just insulted those who disagree with you (called them children). However, I think there is a valid role for insults in this discussion. This often happens btw I don't think it was to do with disagreeing but whether people actually discuss the issues or just post childish insults. |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on Apr 4, 2024 21:02:38 GMT
We're getting ahead of ourselves. We're discussing how to share the spoils of something we don't, and may never, have.
For the moment, we're probably better off putting our energies into making this forum work, by building threads.
As far as I can see, a dual forum is a compromise. Nobody's going to get all they want.
|
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 5, 2024 6:08:48 GMT
We're getting ahead of ourselves. We're discussing how to share the spoils of something we don't, and may never, have. For the moment, we're probably better off putting our energies into making this forum work, by building threads. As far as I can see, a dual forum is a compromise. Nobody's going to get all they want. |
|
|
|
Post by delphicoracle on Apr 5, 2024 6:37:46 GMT
We're getting ahead of ourselves. We're discussing how to share the spoils of something we don't, and may never, have. For the moment, we're probably better off putting our energies into making this forum work, by building threads. As far as I can see, a dual forum is a compromise. Nobody's going to get all they want. I dont belong to either Twitter or Facebook, though I used to use borh. I got fed up with the decline in accepted behaviour and the growth of disgusting personal attacks and amoebic level thinking. Is this now the norm as Orac suggests? Are those who expect intelligent polite conversation now so few that they are a single section subgroup, assigned to mirror and repeat the rest of the forum but more politely? Have the inmates taken over the asylum? This forum is doing fine. To keep it that way means decisive control if some new member(s) start to erode its quality. Frankly it doesnt tilt the earth one millimeter if you throw someone off the forum in order to save its quality as a whole. As said above, you cant be all things to all people, so you either are doomed to repeat the same story or decide this forum has a different character and leave them to scratch each others' eyes out where they are. Intelligent adults shouldnt need babysitting. Or put into a special box. They should be the norm. So far that is the case. And IMO that should be defended against the termites. |
|
|
|
Post by Zany on Apr 5, 2024 6:52:44 GMT
I dont belong to either Twitter or Facebook, though I used to use borh. I got fed up with the decline in accepted behaviour and the growth of disgusting personal attacks and amoebic level thinking. Is this now the norm as Orac suggests? Are those who expect intelligent polite conversation now so few that they are a single section subgroup, assigned to mirror and repeat the rest of the forum but more politely? Have the inmates taken over the asylum? This forum is doing fine. To keep it that way means decisive control if some new member(s) start to erode its quality. Frankly it doesnt tilt the earth one millimeter if you throw someone off the forum in order to save its quality as a whole. As said above, you cant be all things to all people, so you either are doomed to repeat the same story or decide this forum has a different character and leave them to scratch each others' eyes out where they are. Intelligent adults shouldnt need babysitting. Or put into a special box. They should be the norm. So far that is the case. And IMO that should be defended against the termites. This is what I would like as well, but I think its impossible. Its more complicated than people wanting to call names. Most come on these forums to give opinions they are certain the world must agree with, they are angered and annoyed when their views are challenged, they can't believe such counter opinions could even exist and see red. The petty insults come because they feel they are deserved because the views they are reading deserve ridicule. It is quite an ability to read something you know to be inaccurate and not react, but to calmly look for evidence to the contrary, especially if reaction to that is flat denial and a repeat of the original claim. It is possible and I have on a few occasions managed to reach a compromise view on a controversial subject, but even then there are those on the edges of the discussion who do not wish to see compromise, so the petty insults continue. I think a mods job is simply to weed those comments, never able to completely remove them, but to keep them from taking over the garden. |
|
